Habitat Management Related Query

[Monroe]

Opinions Needed:

1. Have 7 acres that we want to plant this spring in Monroe County. There is one ag lime truck spreader in the area but I am afraid they won't be able to make it back to all of the fields. I need to spread 20 tons of lime. Has anyone used the pull behind 1000 lb spreaders before? Will they spread wet aglime? Is there anywhere close to Monroe/Belmont/Washington Counties where I can get bulk aglime? Want to do this yesterday, so any ideas on liming would help.
2. Has anyone tried Penningtons Durana white clover?
http://www.penningtonseed.com/section/wild_game_02.asp?type=products&id=236
If so - how was it?
3. Has anyone tried Biomaxx (corn and soybean blend from Biologic that is roundup ready)?

Thanks
Monroe

[bowhunter1023]

Ohio State Extension Offices (http://extension.osu.edu/)

This is a link to get you in touch with your local co-ops. The co-op should be able to help you find someone/some way to spread the lime. They should be able to give you pointers on getting the lime as well. They help us with our fields every year. If nothing else here is a link to the Green Valley Co-op list of mills in the area: Green Valley Co-op (http://www.greenvalleycoop.com/).

Durana has a high protein level (From 18-28%) making it a great option for woodplots. It also a high grazing tolerance. And it does well in cooler temps...not really the biggest concern around here any more. It should last longer than other common clovers...i.e. ladinos. I have not planted it myself, but a guy I work with has it planted right now and he says it has done better than any other thing he has planted except for turnips. And he has 50-70 deer a night in his fields. (He's from WV and basically has the only food around in his area).

As far as Biomaxx goes...Piss on Biologic. Just my personal opinion. Had a bad experience with them. I know nothing about the stuff.

[Milo]

Opinions Needed:

1. Have 7 acres that we want to plant this spring in Monroe County. There is one ag lime truck spreader in the area but I am afraid they won't be able to make it back to all of the fields. I need to spread 20 tons of lime. Has anyone used the pull behind 1000 lb spreaders before? Will they spread wet aglime? Is there anywhere close to Monroe/Belmont/Washington Counties where I can get bulk aglime? Want to do this yesterday, so any ideas on liming would help.
2. Has anyone tried Penningtons Durana white clover?
http://www.penningtonseed.com/section/wild_game_02.asp?type=products&id=236
If so - how was it?
3. Has anyone tried Biomaxx (corn and soybean blend from Biologic that is roundup ready)?

Thanks
Monroe


Round up ready beans were 28 bucks a bag last year. Beans do better if they are sowed ( or drilled). If you going to use a spreader, be sure you cultipack seeds so they get good soil contact and get put in at a decent depth. Corn needs to be planted deeper too and generally requires fertilizer. Beans don't need fertilizer to grow. We have used a tractor spreader( 3pts) but it only works well with pellitized lime. Bulk lime needs a consistant feed line into the spreader to work well. It will compact on you if it has any moisture in it. Thats why they guys with the trucks can spread it so well with less headaches.

[Monroe]

Thanks,
I contacted GreenValley Coop - they are the ones with the lime trucks. My only worry is that they are only 2wheel drive - and I don't want to get them hung up... Have been waiting for some frozen ground, but mother nature is not cooperating.

Do the beans do well in smaller acreages, or do the deer pound them and leave you dirt?

I have heard a lot of good things about the Durana - I think we will give it a try.

Monroe

[Milo]

Thanks,
I contacted GreenValley Coop - they are the ones with the lime trucks. My only worry is that they are only 2wheel drive - and I don't want to get them hung up... Have been waiting for some frozen ground, but mother nature is not cooperating.

Do the beans do well in smaller acreages, or do the deer pound them and leave you dirt?

I have heard a lot of good things about the Durana - I think we will give it a try.

Monroe
Spread in the spring. there is plenty of time to do beans and clover. You need a good soil temp to get seeds to germinate. Don't get in a big hurry. be sure to spend time knowing how a sprayer works if you do clover. You will need it to knock down the broad leaf. The trick to beans is to get enough rain when they need it to keep up with growth. I would do a 3/4 acre minimum.

[Monroe]

The whole purpose of getting the lime in now is to give it time to buffer the soil. If I spread it in the spring it will have little effect on soil acidity during the springs critical period. That is why I am looking for ideas on liming now - I wish I had gotten it done in the fall - but I was too busy hanging in a tree.

What does a bag of beans cover? I have access to a drill.

Monroe

[Milo]

The whole purpose of getting the lime in now is to give it time to buffer the soil. If I spread it in the spring it will have little effect on soil acidity during the springs critical period. That is why I am looking for ideas on liming now - I wish I had gotten it done in the fall - but I was too busy hanging in a tree.

What does a bag of beans cover? I have access to a drill.

Monroe
I think we do ours at 90-100 pounds per acre( 2 bags approximately) might be a little more or less. We spring lime and have no issues. Just disc it in and you will be fine. If you do lime in the winter and its frozen, the rain will wash it all away unless you get it into the soil to break down. Fall is best but spring will do I promise. just give it a week when its mixed in.

[bowhunter1023]

Here is some more info that might help...

FAQ About Lime (http://ohioline.osu.edu/b760/b760_1.html)

Lime with limited time is better than no lime...But if you plan on planting in February to April as recommended...You better get some on now. Especially with the rain we have been having...Now is a great time to get it down if at all possible. Even if you rut up the field you can fix that when you prepare the seed bed...I'm sure you know that just trying to pat you on the back.

[November Sunrise]

Did you treat the plots several times last fall for weeds? If not, and you're going to go with clover. I'd recommend liming in the spring, hitting your fields with Roundup in early May, early June, and early July, and broadcasting seed around August 1st.

If you go with soybeans, one thing that some guys do in my area is a later than normal planting time - instead of mid to late May when the farmers are planting, they'll put their beans in around July 4th. The net effect of this is that the plants are still green and very attractive to deer in early October. This would also permit several roundup applications previous to planting. One of the risks to this later planting approach is that it may not turn out well if we have a drier than normal summer, such as we experienced in many areas in the summer of '05.

"Ultimate Deer Food Plots" is an outstanding book if you want to broaden your perspective on food plots. It's written by Ed Spinazzola, who's a retired farmer from Michigan, and is an excellent resource for food plotters in the mid west.

There's also a tremendous amount of food plotting ideas, tips, and advice in the whitetail habitat section on michigan-sportsman.com, which is a sister site to this one. There would be plenty of guys on that forum who could provide you with feedback on seed choices.

[Monroe]

Thanks

I am having more of a problem with the logistics of getting lime on the ground than anything else. We are definately going to have a weed problem with these fields, they were last planted about 10 years ago. I mowed them twice last spring/summer and we have some green growth (was pretty ugly before). I need to get them limed and want to get as much attractive forage as possible for next fall - that is why I am just toying with the bean idea. I am definately going to apply some glyphosate, but I am sure we will still have a bad weed problem.

Anyone want to help spread some lime. I figure a bucket brigade would work.

Monroe

[Milo]

Thanks

I am having more of a problem with the logistics of getting lime on the ground than anything else. We are definately going to have a weed problem with these fields, they were last planted about 10 years ago. I mowed them twice last spring/summer and we have some green growth (was pretty ugly before). I need to get them limed and want to get as much attractive forage as possible for next fall - that is why I am just toying with the bean idea. I am definately going to apply some glyphosate, but I am sure we will still have a bad weed problem.

Anyone want to help spread some lime. I figure a bucket brigade would work.

Monroe

Ideally, you should have sprayed twice this summer/fall and then turned the ground under to kill the weeds and get them before the weeds go to seed again. The weeds will be easier to control if you go clover. Soybeans and spray may get very overwhelming. Bucket brigade can work but it sucks. Are you planning on turning the ground over or just cut the top layer up and try to seed?

[bowhunter1023]

Anyone want to help spread some lime. I figure a bucket brigade would work.

It that wasn't sarcasim...I would be willing to come help you for a day if the star aligned. I ain't that far from you, and I love being involved in the kind of stuff. I would trade you a day of spreading lime for a day of putting in hay ;)

[Shed Head]

Monroe, go to the QDMA website, QDMA.com, click on forums, lots of info. on foodplots, should be able to answer any questions you have.

[November Sunrise]

We are definately going to have a weed problem with these fields, they were last planted about 10 years ago. I mowed them twice last spring/summer and we have some green growth (was pretty ugly before). I need to get them limed and want to get as much attractive forage as possible for next fall

I know a lot of guys that have been in your shoes, and I don't know one yet who's been able to establish a successful plot without multiple pre-applications of glyphosate :). Maybe RR beans or corn would be the exception to that.

What's the purpose of the plot? Is it going to be an attractant plot that you hunt over, is it for winter carry over forage, etc? With seven acres you can accomplish both goals - feed the deer over a long period of time, especially during the winter when there's the least available amount of nutritional forage, and also have attractant plantings that are optimal for hunting. Attractant plots work best when planted in mid to late summer.

If you're going to plant the entire 7 acres, I'd avoid sticking with just one plant type. For example, you might surround the plot with a 30-50 ft. wide strip of RR corn. That might be followed with multiple plantings of RR beans - some planted during the traditional timeframe that provides summer attraction, and the remainder planted in early July so that the plant is still green into October. The rest of the plot could then get several doses of glyphosate in late spring and early summer, before a late July to early August planting of clover in one area, and maybe a brassica mix of turnips, canola, and a variety of rape in the remaining area. Just my .02 - take it for what it's worth.

I wonder if there are any equipment rental places in your area that might be able to provide a spreader that could work with an atv. Some guys north of me in Michigan have a spreader that's designed for that purpose - they rent it out for $50/day. Another thought is to check on the forum at qdma.com - maybe there are some users on there from your area who might have equipment available that would work well for spreading lime.

Best of success on your plot:)!

[Monroe]

I hate to even say it on this site for fear of being chastised (but the landowner loves us)- but it is a lease and it is about 1.5 hours from my home. I have equipment, but is it a pain in the butt to get it over there. I did find a local equipment graveyard that had lime spreaders that would hold about 1000lbs. If i can get the lime dumped close to the fields we could do it with local tractor help (which costs me about 30 bucks/hour) or pull my stuff over for a couple of days. When you start running the numbers it is better to get a local.

The main problem is that there is very little ag in the area, and the farmers that are planting are way too busy- and as you know, laugh when I tell them what I am doing. Likewise, there doesn't seem to be a good supply of farm supplies to get what you need done (like the lime). This is easy for me out my back door at home in PA, but a challenge in OH.

We have a larger area (~750 acres) with only 3 fields that are in the center of the property each is a little over 2 acres. At this point I want to get some green in the fields for a little "nutrition" as well as attractant. Thus I am leaning towards clover - which I have the most experience with.

You are all offering good ideas - and I would take you up on the help 1023! - but the logistics are freaking killing me. I love your idea Nov Sunrise - this is exactly what I am imagining - beans/corn on outside and clover/chicory on the inside, but don't know if it is possible this year.

The bottom line is that if I am going to "invest" (my wife hates when i say that because of the lack of $ return) in the establishment of these fields, I don't want to do it half-arsed.

If anyone has the equipment and raring to go for a reasonable price - let me know!

Monroe

[Big H]

I can put you in touch with a guy that does food plots for a living, if you are interested. He lives in Canal Fulton. Let me know.

[Monroe]

Sure - let me know. I am leaving all options open at this point. Its about 115 miles from canal fulton, but worth a call.

Monroe

[Big H]

Funn & Games Food Plots
330-854-3973 ask for Al.

I have no idea what he charges, I only get seed from him from time to time, but he is a super nice guy. Good luck.

[OHBOW76]

Hey I will spread the lime by hand for you for $100 an hour!!!;)

[bowhunter1023]

I'll do it for beer...

[Big H]

How many beers do you charge for each ton?

[bowhunter1023]

Let's see 2,000 pounds in a ton...16 oz. in a pound...16 oz. equals a Tall Boy...8 Tall Boys is a 12 pack of 12 ouncers...Looks like 12 beers per ton...Or 1 beer for every 167 pounds I spread...Sounds about right.

Let the spreading begin http://www.freesmileys.org/emo/eatdrink008.gif (http://www.freesmileys.org)

In all seriousness Monroe...A keg might be cheaper...No but really just send me a PM if you get it all figured out and I will help.

[coonskinner]

it sounds like youre doing a plot...habitat management,i think of something much bigger...:mischeif:

[stoney_bogg]

Hate to tell you or anyone from Ohio this
Go to michigansportsman.com
They have 30 plus pages of deer habitat ideas and suggestions
A separate Forum just for deer habitat, food plots
Lots of good info:)

[Big H]

:nono: :nono: :nono: How come they have a Habitat Management Forum?:confused: :confused:

[Monroe]

Ok, ok - I will quit posting here and go to Michigan Sportsman.

I like beer too.

Coon - 3 keys to wildlife managment: Food, Water, Cover. I have 2 of the three. Go shoot your stickbow or something.

Monroe

[Big H]

Ok, ok - I will quit posting here and go to Michigan Sportsman.

No, keep posting here, and maybe we can get a Habitat Forum.

I like beer too.

Beer is OK.

Coon - 3 keys to wildlife managment: Food, Water, Cover.

Good Point.


Go shoot your stickbow or something.

:yeahthat: :mischeif:

Monroe

We need a Habitat Forum of our own.

[ohiosam]

Monroe,
In your situtation check in to pelleted lime. It's more expensive but works in a regular fertilizer spreader. You wouldn't need as much per acre and it works much faster. The down side is it doesn't last as long and is expensive. If you have a local fertilizer dealer that rents spreaders and blends fertilizers he should have it. You could have it blended with what ever other fertilizers you are using and kill 2 birds with one stone.